I really don't think that Carmela is "jealous" of Ang. Sure she'd like to have a little more dispensible income of her own, but does she really want to run her own business? No. The spec house is just a project. And as for Ang being in control of a "tough business"--a body shop? Tough business? Compared to what, a neighborhood kid cutting grass for spare change?

I think that Carm and Ro are kind of shocked in a way with Angie. They were supposed to be the wives, not the co-conspiritors.

((I hate to nitpick, but I have to...I don't know why, but when people spell Carmela as Carmella, it scrapes a nerve with me...I mean, we've known this family for close to 7 years now!))

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I suspect that running any body shop is fairly tough, but running a body shop with the extra "overhead" that this shop has? It is a front for at least a smidge of illegal activity, yeah? I suppose all of her business associates are really just sweet guys as opposed to ruthless cut-throats. Any neighborhood kid could handle it. Sure.

Ok, here goes: I am sorry I rubbed you the wrong way by using the anglo spelling of CarmeLa. Feel better?

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I wanted to focus less on Angie and more on what Carmela is taking from Angie in all this. I posted on that aspect back here in the ongoing thread about a possible shift in Carmela's values.

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Has anyone else mentioned this...

When Angie was rushing the girls into their menu choice at Vesuvio and when Artie 'presented' the whole piece Seabream fish...the fact that it was a whole fish and so elegantly presented as to make sure we, the viewers, acknowledged it, together to the fact it was specfically framed next to Angie in shot......this had to be some kind of Chase/writer allusion to 'PU$$Y' and his fish manifestation from 'FUNHOUSE' - right?!

I just cannot quite work out if it was done for pure comedic value for us the viewer, in being presented to Angie, Sal's wife, or if it represents a deeper foreshadowing

Giuseppe Soprano

</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p098.ezboard.com/bthechaselounge ... Soprano</A> at: 4/18/06 12:32 pm

Jeff41954 said "Carm can't even get her house built without Tony's help every step of the way. Let's see, Tony provides the money for the house and influence with local officials; Daddy provides the knowledge of the trades and general contracting; and Carmella provides the bitching and the moaning. Then she sees Angie actively and successfully engaged in a very tough business, forcing Carm to face her utter dependence on the men in her life. She likes to think she is so smart! Reality is eating away at her verneer. Angie is tougher and more independent; Meadow is smarter and much better educated; Gab and Ro are more street-wise and comfortable in their lives."

I agree wholeheartedly!

It is also interesting to note that Carmela has had difficulty getting full satisfaction and/or cooperation from just about ALL of the men she relates with in the series whether they are within her family or close associates.

1. Tony - She can influence and help him but she can't control him and relies on his money, influence and support. She is totally dependent upon him.

2. Hugh - She is currently at odds with him. She wants him to work for her and control him but he sees him self as an independant partner who makes decisions without consulting her or in direct defiance of her.

3. AJ - She wants to sheild him from harm and help him get a good education, get a respectable job or at least become a respectable man but he resists her at almost very turn. He directly rebels against her and she can't control him.

4. Christopher - She tried to offer spiritual guidance after he was shot but he rejected it. She also wanted to influence his reationship with Adrianna but that fell through.

5. Uncle Junior - This is too obvious to restate.

6. Furio and Victor Musto - Unable/unwilling to take necessary risks to be with her and consumate a relationship. She had an affect on them but not enough to make them give her what she really wanted.

7. Wegler - Relationship ended when he felt she was manipulating him. She could not SUSTAIN control over him.

8. Father Intintola - We all know how that went.

9. Divorce Lawyers - Ultimately proved to be impotent in helping her gain the control and independence she sought.

This all combines to make her jealous of Angie's position because she seems to accomplish a very high measure of control and influence working with men of all types where she has to put in a lot of work and stress but the rewards are all hers and all earned. She is not forever "reliant on some man" as Meadow told Carmela once.

</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p098.ezboard.com/bthechaselounge ... ackMale</A> at: 4/18/06 12:57 pm

UBM: Very well put. You also reminded me of the time that Angie told Carm she was divorcing Big Pussy. Carm tried unsuccessfully to change Angie's mind.

Ultimately, Tony solved Angie's problem for her, but as best as I can remember, Angie--as decisive as she was--I would have been proud to call her my own daughter!

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I would say envious rather than jealous to describe Carm's feelings about Angie's life. Her spec house project is foundering and apparently out of her control. Notice that in the bedroom when Tony says to her something like, "Busy bee," she remarks, "Not really." She wants, needs a purpose to her life.

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maybe she will poison tony one day to become just as free as angie.two or three years without him in her neck and she will be successfull.

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Jeff--no need to apologize.

I agree with your comments about Carmela being bitchy. However, I think that her bitching is well founded. Her father doesn't know what he's doing, and her project is going down the shitter. I almost feel bad for her. She really wanted this spec house, and she can't get it accomplished.

I agree with Carm being envious of Angie. However, I'm not too sure. I think she may be pissed that Ang' isn't one of them; she is now really an outsider. I got the feeling that Carm doesn't really like Ang, nor did she ever. She (rightfully so) looked really pissed and uncomfortable when Angie breezed into Vesuvio's and took over the conversation, then left abruptly.

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Quoting Brendan: "She really wanted this spec house, and she can't get it accomplished."

You make my point for me.

By the way. Her father knows what he is doing. He got the architect and got the house to the point it is and would be well on his way to finishing it if CarmeLa would just do her part. He knew the code but used the cheaper grade of lumber intentionally. CarmeLa was supposed to take care of the building inspector, but she can't get it done!

She should just have another baby and forget "her business".

Or, maybe she should get Angie to finish the house for her. That way it would get done.


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