Re: Best of Season so Far

Moved from another thread


Posts: 2
Posted: 3/28/06 8:21 am
Sylvio's and Paulie's True Feelings of Tony
I am not sure if others were moved by the scenes where Sylvio and Paulie were first able to see and visit Tony in the hospital. I thought these were very touching moments. I got chills when the camera closes in the shot of Sylvio touching Tony's hand. There is no doubt that there is genuine affection between these characters. As we know, however, these are very complex relationships and these guys are not just best friends, but business partners. Here lies the conflict in their relationships. We see this conflict in the scenes of Sylvio pndering being the Boss and the Paulie having to give Carmela her cut of the robbery proceeds. I thought it might be interesting to chat about Sylvio's and Paulie's true feelings of Tony and where these relationships might go.



Re: Episode Review (post all general comments here)

Chase-Machine in high sentimentality mode.
I Love it. I also love my dog. (Okay, I don't really have a dog...)

I do love Matrix-Revolutions; Signs; Flatliners; Irreversible, and prefer the final-fifteen episodes of Twin-Peaks to Blue Velvet...but I'd never admit to any of that in polite company.

I remember feeling exactly the same whilst watching the last ever episode of Six Feet Under as I did when I watched Mayham last night. I recall thinking there's an entire season's worth of stuff to get through here and they're squeezing it all into this one episode.

Don't get me wrong, I couldn't resist Mayham even if I tried.
But I think it's DC who's having the ID crisis here. He can't work out if his surname is Chase, Fincher, or Lynch.

For me, this was the perfect embalming of a show alluding to being betrothed to synthetic realism. Anything can happen now guys, and I do mean anything. Spin-offs, movies; Tony might even die at the end and they could bring him back - judging by the reaction Mayham seems to be getting thus far (I'm reading things like 'the best episode ever'...?)
Naturalism, the willing participation of the characters in accepting the facts of life, you name me everything now seems to be victim to idealism.

A show that is so quick to portray graphic, brutal rape without a second thought to the viewer's sensibilities; a woman being beaten to death barehanded; the constant, prolonged overuse of naturalistic violence; the amount of sheer depth everyone has invested in these characters...what happened last night guys? And can anyone tell me why I accepted it just as much as the next guy?

Again, I'm in love with the episode. It had everything. But I have to say, it isn't just Carmela that's worried anymore.

I'm not trying to be controversial here. If anything (and I have to say this), I'm almost at the point of doubting just how much of a genius Chase really is. I love the show for many different reasons. One of them being the way it seemlessly blended elements of the surreal with that of what consists of matter. I think if Chase even thinly disguised Tony's adventures as an actual manifestation of a dream (both in Join the Club and Mayham) then I would have slept better last night.

If I could just put this out there okay - can I ask (and I know it wasn't) but can I ask how everyone would feel if this was the last ever episode of The Sopranos?

I guess I need to do some thinking.....

</p>Edited by: <A HREF= ... >Catherine Tramell</A> at: 3/28/06 10:05 am

Re: Episode Review (post all general comments here)

thinking about everyone saying Vito is going to get it soon, I rewatched the episode. There were at least 2 scenes where Vito was in the frameshot of an orange (once with Larry Boy and another with Carmela in the cafeteria - "looking over our shoulder")...If history repeats, his days are numbered.

Oh, if you don't know the signifance of the orange, watch the Godfather or Episode 12 where Tony first gets shot.


Re:chase sentimentality

provocative post CathT.
and i'm still working out my thoughts on my reactions to it. here are some initial thoughts:

i think this is *one* of the best Sopranos episodes in part just because it's so amazingly tight. so much in one episode, so expertly pulled off, etc.

Chase often says the Sopranos is a 'slow build,'' well, IMHO, this is one of those 'pay off' episodes that took six seasons to build up to, and to properly appreciate. yes parts of it were sentimental, but Tony is a sentimental guy and the show is about his psyche/soul. it's to be expected that at some point we are going to see those themes dealt with directly (without the filter of Melfi or without merely being hinted at thru the symbolism and foreshadowing that so many of us have been paying attention to over the past six seasons)

i can see why some would think the Buscemi scene and the deathbed tears were 'pedestrian' - but we are dealing with a life/death scene here and some universial themes and truths (i.e. the white light, the fact that people get extremely sentimental and idealistic when someone is dying, etc.) are in order.

actually, if you think about it ,Chase used a lot of restraint and avoided so many of the cliches that i think other TV/FILM people (alan ball?) would have fallen into (like having Tony meet with Ade and others on the 'other side' or having Tony directly confronted with his moral choices as Tony Soprano) instead, we got something much denser and thought provoking with all sorts of mystical, literary, religious and even mythological under & overtones -- while at the same time making subtle comments about the post 9/11 world, consumerism, pop culture, corporate life, selective memory ('believing/remembering what we want to believe/remember'), etc.

I don't think this stuff came out of the blue either.

i also don't see the episode as necessarily 'surreal' - 'Test Dream' was more classically surreal in my mind.

bottom line: i don't think Chase is going in any Lynchian direction - the show, to me, has always been modeled on straightfoward epical themes (a la Beowulf!) and will stay true to those roots.

it's also about a mob family trying to survive in the 21st centuy and i don't think for a minute chase has lost sight of that angle. based on the Tony-Chris scene, and the previews for this Sunday, it looks like Tony is pulled back into the here and now pretty quickly

</p>Edited by: <A HREF= ... daMaria</A> at: 3/28/06 10:03 am

Re: Best of Season so Far

I think Sil's love and respect for T is genuine. I'm not so sure about Paulie.

In the hospital room, Paulie didn't show any connection to T. Sil came up and held T's hand. Paulie sat in a chair far away from him then proceeded to talk about himself, his problems, etc. When T's monitor went off and all hell broke loose, Paulie looked, to me, like he felt guilty, or at least like he wanted to get out of there (notice how he practically slunk out of the room) so he wouldn't get blamed for anything. Then, of course, he proceeded to make up the story about holding T's hand.

Couple that with his two-faced act with Carm and his deep resentment for having to give her money because T is going to live, and I just don't see him as caring much for T at all.


Re: EdaMaria

EdaMaria, thanks for that.

I really can't think of anything better to say at the moment other than - 'when you put it like that'...

Just to add: I didn't think it was cliched at-all. I guess my main concern was that Chase seemed to prolong Discorporate-Tony longer than I thought was necessary. Although I implied I thought the thematics of the episode were hastened almost to the point of making me wonder why we as viewers are at this critical moment in Tony's life and so soon, I did feel that by retaining a downright veridical character like Tony Soprano in this fantastical Limbo and in such a way (two episodes!) was bordering on the pretentious.

After your words I'm now reevaluating said concerns and can only thank you again for your consideration.


Re: EdaMaria

<blockquote>Quote:<hr> I think Sil's love and respect for T is genuine. I'm not so sure about Paulie.

In the hospital room, Paulie didn't show any connection to T. Sil came up and held T's hand.<hr></blockquote>

I noticed Sil's genuine concern for Tony when he held his hand JUST like how Carm held his hand a few scenes earlier. Like Carmella, without Tony Sil realizes that he can't fill his shoes.

Carmella represents why Tony needs to be alive for his nuclear family, Sil represents why Tony needs to be alive for his business family. I thought that was a subtle but brilliant few scenes, well acted, well played.


Re: Best of Season so Far

"Mayham" knocked me out, best of the season, by far. One of the great alltime episodes!

Got back to telling the story of mob innerworkings. The bit where they are discussing the movie pitch for "Cleaver" {Slasher flick meets Godfather 2} was hilarious. Paulie and Chris were a riot, completely selfish and self-centered as always. Best use of Silvio, ever. And Vito is emerging as a villianous rat on the level of Ralph and Richie Aprile, I think he is destined for the same fate. Many ways they could go with this, what if Meadow puts things together and figures Finn's life is in danger...would she have him whacked? {yes}

The scene with Buscemi was brilliant, I was really wondering if Tony/Finnerty would cross over to the other side, I really thought we would see in the room people from Tony's past, besides Livia...Johnny Boy, Ade, ralph, Pussy, Mikey Palmice.


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