Re: Paulie gave order to kill Tony.

#11
Hi Silvio.
Your theory is credible as a possibility. I strongly agree with your points of Paulie's character and development and presentation, especially the turmoil. And we certainly saw clearly at times where Paulie's loyalties were conflicted, where he'd look for the best possible outcome for himself, despite current, peristant and long- standing loyalties, devotions and emotional ties.
He certainly had the potential and possible motivation at times to act quickly, make impulsive judgements and perhaps have Tony killed, possibly to deeply regret it to never ending inner conflict subsequently. Now That reaction would have been an interesting arc to explore - if Paulie did have direct or even passive involvement if Tony was assassinated, would his turmoil continue and increase from that, or would be move on similar to Tony moving on from taking out Chris? And with a similar dynamic in relationships between the two pairs...
I'd believe, in that scenario, that Paulie may soon eventually have taken his own life.
Yet, I don't believe we will ever know, and I don't yet see enough or a supported argument to lead to a near definitive conclusion.

Re: Paulie gave order to kill Tony.

#12
Sorry but I don't see it at all. Almost all of the points in the OP are the definition of "reaching," and many of them make the flawed assumption that Chase planned for Tony to be killed by Paulie as far back as Season 2, which is impossible. He didn't even come up with the ending until at least 2004 or 2005. You can look at the last couple seasons and scour them for clues, especially looking at Season 6 for stuff related to Tony's death etc., but there was no grand master plan for the entire series; it was not written with Holstens/the NY-NJ war/Phil/Paulie/Members Only guy/etc. as an endpoint. I would say Season 4 is the earliest you can look and see possible hints of the ending, but even then it's basically coincidence or just mild, non-specific or unintentional clues which happened to foreshadow what happened. Really, Season 6 is the only one that was written with Tony's death in mind, and indeed starting with Members Only the clues come fast and quick -- nowhere in Season 1-5 do you get such obvious, clear nods to the end. So I don't think one can point to the early seasons -- certainly not the first three -- and try to tie them into Holstens or MIA.

Anyway, I just don't get this feeling of a menacing threat coming from Paulie in the last episode at all. If anything, he's just his usual idiotic self. The most I'd grant is that he may have been approached by NY and, given no real choice, turned over to them -- this is what would likely happen anyway in the aftermath of Tony's death. But these things aren't shown onscreen, anyway, and can't be proven. All this speculation about who killed Tony is just that, speculation; it cannot be proven or even given a large amount of evidence because even the most guilty-looking parties don't get that much emphasis thrown their way by Chase. It's all very understated and deliberately ambiguous as to who killed Tony, but there's at least a dozen characters I'd put before Paulie. As far as I'm concerned, the real foreboding and hints of betrayal and Tony's doom come from characters like Butchie, Carlo and, especially, Patsy. In a key scene in MIA, Patsy says, "A lot of my customers are giving their action to New York." Carlo responds, with a twitchy, suspicious look on his face, "Power vacuum, they take advantage." This exchange, Carlo's flipping, Patsy's behavior at Tony's house in MIA (and his wife eyeing the Sopranos's fine china), the linking of the two Jasons, and the fact that Carlo's cousin Burt Gervasi flipped to NY just before his death at the beginning of Blue Comet... all these things point to Patsy and Carlo being trouble for Tony, infinitely more than Paulie, who is at heart just a cowardly kiss-ass who would only accept Tony's death if NY forced him at gunpoint, but hardly has this hidden dark side where he's willing and ready to personally order Tony's execution in front of his family. If it was Chase's intent to communicate in MIA that Paulie is a threat to Tony, then he failed spectacularly. It simply is not there, no more than my brand new theory that Carmella had Tony whacked is there.

The somewhat far-fetched AJ/Rhiannon/Patsy theory (by Mike Cole) holds much more weight than anything to do with Paulie IMO.

Re: Paulie gave order to kill Tony.

#13
I think its safe to say that Chase definitely made it a possibility, whether it was him or not or whoever it really was didn't seem that important to Chases narrative. It could've been anyone, anytime. So I think Paulie is like a "keep you enemies close" kinda situation. Remember When? Remember that episode? Says it all, I don't even have to type. He's just another guy who could've pulled a trigger or give the order. Its just fun to think about, thats exactly what Chase wanted imo, in that way it keeps the show forever new in a way, thinking about all the people it "could've" been. So fucking brilliant on Chases part!
[font="Franklin Gothic Medium"]You know, Vito called me “skip” the other day. Slip of the tongue, no doubt. But I noticed he didn’t correct himself.[/font][SIZE="1"][/SIZE]

Re: Paulie gave order to kill Tony.

#14
SilvioMancini wrote:I think its safe to say that Chase definitely made it a possibility, whether it was him or not or whoever it really was didn't seem that important to Chases narrative. It could've been anyone, anytime. So I think Paulie is like a "keep you enemies close" kinda situation. Remember When? Remember that episode? Says it all, I don't even have to type. He's just another guy who could've pulled a trigger or give the order. Its just fun to think about, thats exactly what Chase wanted imo, in that way it keeps the show forever new in a way, thinking about all the people it "could've" been. So fucking brilliant on Chases part!


And again, in misterie's word "only speculation" and "ambiguity"
And it seems Silvio may agree, tho misterie believes differently - Chase's intent was to be ambiguous about these things - including the when and how and why of Tony's inevitable mortal death.
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