Re: Any Thoughts on Marie Spatafore? Good Mom? Bad Mom?

#11
Not to reply to anything previously stated, but as a mother (and a lioness of a mother at that), I have some major problems with Marie's decisionmaking.
In general, good mothers don't:

-Reach out to violent criminals to "fix" a problem child's behaviour.

-Don't even consider therapy (school-appointed social worker aside).

-Allow your son to be kidnapped by strangers in the dead of night and be taken to a discipline camp when he has exhibited a deep need for psychological help.

-Allow said kidnapping to be witnessed by your already deeply traumatized and confused 9-year old daughter, and when she expresses fear and confusion, tell her to go back to bed.


VJ needs to be in intense psychotherapy, on medication, and possibly a couple of weeks in an adolescent unit of a private psych hospital. The act of shitting and stepping in it in front of people is a huge red flag signaling deep, deep mental disturbance. But Marie's answer is to just relocate him, one way or another.

I know it was Tony's idea, the discipline camp; I know he suggested it over other things because it was ultimately cheaper; I know she could have said no. A good mother would have taken the 18K and used it towards inpatient psych treatment for the boy.

That scene when he was taken from his bed totally ripped my heart out. As much or more as Ade's death scene. AHHH! BAD MOMMY!

You can rest assured that fucked-up little VJ will have Mommy AND Daddy issues for the rest of his life. Which will probably not last much longer.

Re: Any Thoughts on Marie Spatafore? Good Mom? Bad Mom?

#12
hecatae3 wrote:Not to reply to anything previously stated, but as a mother (and a lioness of a mother at that), I have some major problems with Marie's decisionmaking.
In general, good mothers don't:

-Reach out to violent criminals to "fix" a problem child's behaviour.

-Don't even consider therapy (school-appointed social worker aside).

-Allow your son to be kidnapped by strangers in the dead of night and be taken to a discipline camp when he has exhibited a deep need for psychological help.

-Allow said kidnapping to be witnessed by your already deeply traumatized and confused 9-year old daughter, and when she expresses fear and confusion, tell her to go back to bed.


VJ needs to be in intense psychotherapy, on medication, and possibly a couple of weeks in an adolescent unit of a private psych hospital. The act of shitting and stepping in it in front of people is a huge red flag signaling deep, deep mental disturbance. But Marie's answer is to just relocate him, one way or another.

I know it was Tony's idea, the discipline camp; I know he suggested it over other things because it was ultimately cheaper; I know she could have said no. A good mother would have taken the 18K and used it towards inpatient psych treatment for the boy.

That scene when he was taken from his bed totally ripped my heart out. As much or more as Ade's death scene. AHHH! BAD MOMMY!

You can rest assured that fucked-up little VJ will have Mommy AND Daddy issues for the rest of his life. Which will probably not last much longer.


I tend to concur with this outlook, but I probably sympathize with Mrs. Vito more than I should. Her husband was killed, her son is seriously messed up and she doesn't relaly know what to do. Her idea to move to Maine was a patchwork fix at best, it is obvious that she is lost as to what to do. Seeking counsel from Phil and/or Tony wasn't a great idea either, but I really can't blame her given her current situation.
A little powdered sugar and he woulda been done!

Re: Any Thoughts on Marie Spatafore? Good Mom? Bad Mom?

#13
Hecatae3,

Thanks very much for your post. When I started this thread, I was hoping for some posts from people who have kids (I don't have any).

I thought that Marie's actions were not those of a good mother but I don't blame her in the sense of her being a bad mother. Instead, I think that llike her son, she has been stressed past some kind of breaking point and is making bad decisions - not because she is a bad mom, but because she has been stressed past some breaking point.

Her plan to move to Maine sounded like some kind of fantasy going back in time to her old friend to an old time when things were better for her. It would have removed some of the problems from her family, but only a small fraction. Most of the problems would remain.

I have to agree with Hectae3 insofar as Vito having some extremely serious problems that will require a lot of help - much more than a simple move to Maine can help.

For people with children, this must be a real tragedy. It would seem that life slapped the child with a problem that he can't "fix" on his own, that wasn't his fault and that seems to be beyond any easy solution. This must be the sort of thing that just breaks a parent's heart.

Re: Any Thoughts on Marie Spatafore? Good Mom? Bad Mom?

#14
There's nothing Marie can do directly to help Vito Jr. What she needs to do is find him a new male role model.

He seemed to be a good kid before the incident with his dad. Marie seemed to be the image of a good mother from what little we saw. I don't see it as her fault, the condition that Vito Jr. is in.

She is unable to provide what he needs at this point.

His problem lies in his identity. His only male role model, Vito Sr., is now an image of weakness and disgrace, which is an idea that is condoned and even propagated by all current adults in his life other than Marie.

His only window to manhood was shattered. Asking him to step up as man of the household is something he is simply incapable of doing.

No adult males love him as their own. Tony and Phil's half hearted attempts to straighten him out are useless because neither one of them are going to be a stable figure in Vito Jr.'s life. There's no reason for Vito Jr. to listen.

Re: Any Thoughts on Marie Spatafore? Good Mom? Bad Mom?

#15
There is still something nagging me about the scene where Tony calls Marie and tells her about the boot camp.

It seems to me that it was very important in this scene for Marie to appear conflicted - as if she was thinking of saying, "no" - or maybe asking Tony to give her the $18K and letting her arrange something herself - or maybe something else.

She didn't just say, "OK, Tony. Thanks". There was a very, very long pause with a lot of emphasis spent on Marie's face - looking at some of her facial expressions. I don't understand exactly what we were supposed to get out of this scene, but it seems like it was important and that they were trying to project some kind of meaning. Because it was a very unusually long time and we were shown a lot of conflict in Marie's face.

Perhaps it had something to do with Tony's bullshit about how he was moved to tears ... or whatever he said. Marie's bullshit meter probably picked that up fairly easily. But there was something going on in her mind.

I'd really like to know what we were supposed to get out of this scene. Surely it wasn't just "filler". I mean surelyl they didn't have an extra 40 seconds they needed to fill.

Does anyone have any idea what that might have been about?

Re: Any Thoughts on Marie Spatafore? Good Mom? Bad Mom?

#16
Splishak wrote:
I'd really like to know what we were supposed to get out of this scene. Surely it wasn't just "filler". I mean surelyl they didn't have an extra 40 seconds they needed to fill.

Does anyone have any idea what that might have been about?


Perhaps it was to highlight the quandry she is in. She had her hopes up to move (for better or worse) and Tony shot that down. She is now left with very few options, and she knows it. I recall seeing a similar look on Eugene's face in Members Only. Utter dissappoint. To be honest, I felt terrible for her right there.

But I'm just a big softie.
A little powdered sugar and he woulda been done!
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