Re: Episode Review and General Comments

#122
Perhaps NY and NJ do not need to go to war. Chase has bmade it clear that this thing is a business, and money is lost at war. This show is about Tony and his families, the actual one and his business one. I think that eventhough there has been alot of bickering with NY over the years, I doubt they will have a full scale war, Tony is too smart for that. The scene in the hospital shows that Tiny cares more for his close loved ones and more for making money than he does about his pride.

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Re: Episode Review and General Comments

#123
It looks to me like Chase's last 8 episodes
will necessarily involve using the "Hail Mary
Pass."
www.answers.com/topic/hail-mary-pass

The words of the Hail Mary

English

Hail Mary, full of grace,
the Lord is with thee;
blessed art thou amongst women,
and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.
Holy Mary, Mother of God,
pray for us sinners, now and at
the hour of our death.
Amen.

Chase has molto religious conflicts, imho.
I hope in the last 8 episodes, he's able,
through Tony with the help of Melfi, to
come to terms with his many demons.

I'm no longer a practicing Roman Catholic.
But having been brought up one in the town
of Kearny and residing in the town of
Bloomfield, NJ for many years, I sometimes
get very creeped-out by Chase's intuitive, twisted,
yet convincing creative genre with "The Sopranos."

It's as if he's been watching over my left shoulder
since 1999. My paternal grandfather from Sicily,
converted to an extreme Protestant sect years
ago, and caused tremendous upheavals in
the lives of his wife and seven children. I won't
go further here into the gory details...

I'm just expecting Chase to come clean or else
"The Sopranos" will wind up a cariacture almost
as ridiculous as it's possible aberrant HBO twin,
"Big Love," with its portrayals of creepy,
Mormonesque, polygamistic debacles.


These shows aren't reality, but have an agenda,
and they falter into today's media-driven, fanatical
mediocrities. That is sad...

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Re: Episode Review and General Comments

#124
SoccerStud: You're right. They don't have to go to war. But if they're going to build up this tension between NJ/NY each season, I think they need to resolve it more honestly than having the Boss get arrested or the Next-in-Line suffer a heart attack. It's just much too convenient.

After awhile, the viewer is going to feel cheated and a little bit used, and I think that explains some of the disappointment people have had with this final season so far. The payoff hasn't matched the promise, and I don't think you can blame the viewer for expecting too much. They've been set up to expect a lot.

How many times can they tell us that Christopher is an addict or that Carm worships money over her self-professed morals? We understand. We have the first element of drama -- complication. What we don't have is the final element -- resolution. Instead, it's just one long tease. And teasing that lasts too long turns into frustration.

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Re: Episode Review and General Comments

#125
While I would certainly agree with the sentiments Fly wrote about, I would disagree about only listening to one voice as an artist. Especially in a medium like theatre/film. I think the Lucas comparison is probably apt in a way. Part of what led to some of what people disliked about Lucas' latest efforts was the fact that in the end, there was no one with authority enough that he might listen to in order to change what might not have worked. Thus, he ended with subpar material compared to his previous efforts. Self-indulgent, I call it - at least to a point.

In theatre (of which I am trained and worked in for ten years) I find the collaborative process to be the strongest single thing that leads to a satisfying result on stage (and on screen.) While I would never suggest any artist listen and/or tailor their work to critic's tastes, I would suggest that listening and working closely with those collaborating with you is extremely important.

With that said, who is to say that Chase did not? One might consider this was part of what led to the departure of Green and Burgess, but there is no way to know.

And I appreciated the dinner plate reference. While I recognize that Chase owes me nothing, I would suggest that one has plenty of right to offer criticism of a restaurant if it has constantly produced above average food for a lengthy period of time and then suddenly the chef changes directions that is not to the patron's taste. Of course, those patrons can choose not to return.

I would like to see criticism of what has been offered by Chase be constructive, not because Chase might read it (though at least if he did, he would be more apt to consider what is said) but that it keeps the level of discourse civil and informative. This place exists to offer opinions - that does not mean they all have to be positive. I think most of us are coming at this from a position of love and care for Chase 's creation. And while we all reserve the right to voice our opinions, we ought to keep them level headed, constructive and fair.

Edit - And I should add, I think most thus far have been at this place.

</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://p098.ezboard.com/bthechaselounge.showUserPublicProfile?gid=detectivehunt>Detective Hunt</A> at: 6/7/06 11:09 am

Re: Episode Review and General Comments

#126
I admire the heck out of David Chase; look at my screen name. But there were several times this year when I felt he and the others were writing as if someone were looking over their shoulders.

It's one thing to zig when everyone expects you to zag. That makes the show interesting. But it's another thing to promise drama -- by building up plot strands, and through the various trailers -- and then not delivering. Then it becomes manipulative.

To me, Johnny Sack getting arrested at the end of last season, and Phil's heart attack this season, are both classic <blockquote>Quote:<hr>examples of what's called deus ex machina -- "any artificial or improbable device resolving the difficulties of the plot."

Yes, sure, Johnny could have gotten arrested, and Phil could have had a heart attack. These things happen. But for plot purposes, what both of those episodes did was remove the need for a showdown between NY and NJ, which had been one of the central plot engines during both seasons. Just like that, Tony's problems went away (at least temporarily, in Phil's case.)

Of course viewers are going to be disappointed. They had been led to believe there would be a dramatic payoff and they didn't get it.<hr></blockquote>

Wow, Chaseisstillgod hit it right on the head.

WAY TOO MANY OUT OF THE BLUE MOMENTS MORE THAN ANY OTHER SEASON.

What the hell does having a heart attack have to do with guilt? Someone posted that Phil had a heart attack because he felt guilty.......LMAO. I guess Tony Soprano is long overdue for a heart attack.

I

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Re: Episode Review and General Comments

#127
I think what is a bit more maddening (and perplexing) was David Chase's assertion that "originally, we were only going to do a sixth season, and that's it. As we went along developing the story arcs, we realized that in order to finish everything we'd need additional episodes to finally get to some sort of closure" (all just paraphrased, but fairly accurate).

So spending half a season dealing with Vito, a throwaway episode of Paris, yet another throwaway episode dealing with Artie....etc was contributing to closing out the whole show? There just seemed like so much filler, and that the entire arc could've easily been resolved this season.

I agree, there just seemed to be a LOT of milking going on this season.



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Re: Episode Review and General Comments

#128
<blockquote>Quote:<hr>What the hell does having a heart attack have to do with guilt? Someone posted that Phil had a heart attack because he felt guilty.......LMAO. <hr></blockquote>
That was me, though I didn't put it exactly like that. I said he had a lot of guilt about having Vito whacked. Guilt can lead to stress, and stress is a definite risk factor. Phil isn't an easygoing type of guy. He smokes, he probably has high-blood pressure, and high cholesterol also would be likely.

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Re: Episode Review and General Comments

#129
I've gotta disagree on the heart attack; I think it provides some nice symmetry. At either end of the season, you have a boss facing a health crisis, while in the middle, a third boss was sentenced to 15 years. Being a "mob boss" takes a toll or two. I think it's fair to say we now know what was keeping Phil awake at the end of episode 11--chest pains. The stress of the job, aggravated by a nagging bible-thumper of a wife. Look at what happened to Sil. Heck, the job drove Tony to a shrink. <img src=http://www.ezboard.com/images/emoticons/laugh.gif ALT=":lol">

In any case, we now have both NJ and NY headed by bosses who have faced health crises, and (provided Frank Vincent signs his contract) we'll see how both respond, and how both mob-families respond to them. I didn't think it was "cheap" at all.

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Re: Episode Review and General Comments

#130
Another retreaded aspect that I don't think has been mentioned is Tony's love affair with his mother... Hasn't Melfi already touched on this with Tony? It is a shame Chase is so fine with repeating himself. Also a plot device that was just tacked on this season (Like Sil's breathing problem), was Vito's relation to Phil. That addition alone could be considered The Sopranos' shark jumping. When Chase deemed it ok to just start making up a backstory that doesn't match past episodes we should've been prepared for this season. If he was trying to prove that he doesn't have any truly interesting characters (aside from Tony who is also becoming repetitive), mission accomplished. This finale is amazing for one reason, it signifies the beginning of Deadwood.


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