a theory

#81
I have theory that may explain why some people didn't like this episode very much.

My idea is that there are two types of viewers of the show.

One type are those who like to, for lack of a better word, idolize Tony and his crew. Sure, they know they're killers and all, and they don't actually want violence to happen in the real world. But in the show, they like to hear the funny lines they give and they imagine what it would be like to not take any crap from anyone. These are the people who really like Phil Leotardo and Feech because these 'old-school' mobsters epitomize the 'coolness' of what mobsters are. Hence when an episode like "In Camelot" makes them uncomfortable while watching Fran's freaky "Mr. President" routine and Phil Leotardo run and act afraid, they don't like to see that side of these characters.

The other type of fans of the show (which I include myself as a member) don't idolize the mobsters but see them depicted as basically thugs. However, they are beautifully portrayed thugs, having the nuanced-complexities that all real people have. They don't mind if the series makes a point to show how uneducated Tony and his pals are, and we like that Melfi calls Tony on all his hypocrisy. We like the show the best when these characters reveal their frailties and ultimately their humanity. That is what much of this week's show was about.

Don't get me wrong. I think the entertaining aspects of the mob life style with the cash and violence and strippers is part of what makes the show appealing. But what makes the Sopranos the best series in the history of TV is its attention to the psychological subtleties of these characters and the way events just pour out on screen like real-life. Some threads pick up again and some don't (just like actual life) but these characters are *always* complex and human.

And that's what keeps me riveted to the show.




</p>Edited by: <A HREF=http://pub132.ezboard.com/bsopranolandforum.showUserPublicProfile?gid=bishopnull@sopranolandforum>bishop null</A> at: 4/20/04 3:03 pm

The only thing that I hate

#82
<blockquote>Quote:<hr>If there's one thing I dislike about these message boards, it's that no one likes to admit when an episode is not very good. <hr></blockquote>
If there's one thing that I hate, it's that some people can't understand that every episode is part of A SEASON. Each episode has more CHARACTER- than plot-development. Every time when someone doesn't understand the brilliant nuances, they think that the episode was boring, or nothing happened in it. I hate all the b*tching and complaining if it's pointless.

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Now I get it

#83
One thing I like about this website, is seeing how others view this show. It adds to the rich storylines of it, like from reading the posts in this thread, I better understand the part of the theme of this episode - love and live richly vs. lust and live poorly, a morality tale. We see this in ep Fran, Junior, Tony and even to some extent, Chris never really finding love but rather going for the superficial, materialistic and narsscissic, rather than real relationships and then seeking substitution in power, booze, sex, drugs. We also understand better the relationship of Tony and his father and mother as well as understanding the beheavor of his mother. Tony is seeing how he acts much like his father. Tony may not be able to go back to Carm as she is distancing herself from him and then Tony seeing how he could end up like Fran or Junior. I agree that the last scenes of Fran singing to Tony and then Tony bragging of Fran was wierd and unconfortable, but made it's point. This episode I rated 3 of 5, but as stated in another post, still this episode is important to the storyline, we got some violence (re Hesh clash by Tony), some good scenes by Junior and his twisted and great humor.

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Re: Now I get it

#85
Bishop null:

Actually there are three types of viewers and I am this type. I love gangsters, gangster shows/movies & intelligent TV writing. I want to think about & get involved with the characters and see how they operate in a realistic way.

And as you put it, ?attention to the psychological subtleties? is a key point.

I want to see the human & complex side of a character. I see Tony experience something and say, ?Hey, I went through that too.?

Sopranos definitely fits the bill here! I love the Sopranos!

Old Maid


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Thank you OldMaid54

#86
I think too many people on this forum either (1) imply that a poster isn't intelligent enough to understand any given episode, or the entire series for that matter, or (2) pretend not to be smart enough to understand any given episode.

You don't have to be a genius to understand and enjoy what (I"m sure all of us would agree is) the best television drama ever, you only have to give it some thought and understand that not every episode stands alone, that since the beginning of the series certain storylines go on and on while others end abruptly. All your questions won't be answered by the end of any episode, nor by (I predict) the series finale.

I know I wasn't the only person who choked up a bit a near the end of the episode Sunday while Tony told Melfi about his mother's miscarriage. No other television show does that to me, and even a good (but not great) episode like "In Camelot" is far better than anything else on tv.

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Re: Thank you OldMaid54

#87
I agree with that SilsBullHorn.

I didnt think this was the greatest episode but like you said its better than other crap on TV. Also, I like picking apart the episode like everyone else here but I think compared to other episodes it was sub-par and could have been better and more interesting. I DONT think just having people get whacked makes it a great show (Thats what some around here acuse others of only wanting if we say the show was not that great) but I do like suspense such as the suspense I feel with Ade and her situation sometimes. Nobody necessary has to get whacked for it to be a gripping, edge of your seat show. This ep was not horrible but I just think it lacked and dragged. I wanna see more Paulie and the crew. This whole thing showed an entertaining side of Chris but it was like a rehash of Davy Scatino. I will admit I loved the whole Junior thing. The poor guy needs to get out of his house more.

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Re: Thank you OldMaid54

#88
Yes, that was my point exactly. I get very tired of hearing people accused of "not getting it" or not appreciating the subtleties when they don't like an episode. I "got" the episode. I appreciated parts of the episode including the subtext. I still don't think it's a very good episode as a whole; it was a little slow.

I did really like the Junior storyline - it was paced about right. The Chris one was OK, but too much of a retread. But every time Fran was on screen the story slowed to a crawl. I would have liked to have seen longer scenes with Tony confronting Hesh and the meeting with Phil and Sack, and expand more on the flashback and the subsequent scene with Melfi. That could have revealed even more insight while moving things along at a better pace.

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