Re: Favorite Quotes from 'The Second Coming'

#31
asianguy63 wrote:"or he could just be a fuckin idiot...historically thats been the case"


"Get a mop"

"Your their son you will always be more important"

"Oh poor you" Livias old line which tony has quoted many times this season

"Its ok baby its ok" Tony to aj after he pulls him out of the water

This was such an emotional episode yet there was still some humor in it.

Another part that cracked me up was how Carm reacted to who Meadow has been dating
[font="Verdana"][SIZE="4"]Peace & Love Lady Soprano<3[/SIZE][/font]

Re: Favorite Quotes from 'The Second Coming'

#32
I would add Tony's line, "You're a momma's boy!" which he said to AJ during the therapy session with AJ, Tony, Carm and AJ's shrink.

It's not so much the words he spoke, but he spoke them in exactly the same intonation as Junior used to use when he said cruel things to Tony. I seem to remember one thing he said to Tony or about Tony, "He was a hothouse flower." I don't know what it means, but it sounds like a synonym for "wimpy". It is like watching Tony devolve into Junior and passing this behavior along to AJ who will pass it along, in turn. Holy Shit!

Anyway, Junior has said other things (I think one was, "He never had the makings of a varsity athlete") and if you check some of those scenes and compare them to Tony's saying, "You're a momma's boy!", I believe you will find the exact same intonation.

It's interesting that lately Tony is saying the same things that both Livia and Junior have said in the past. If not the exact same words, then the same intonation. It's as if I was listening to Junior say that line. Clementine made a stunning point in another thread along the lines that Tony married his mother. I had never seen that before, but now, I can see it in so many ways, Carm is very much like Livia. And now we see Tony devolving into his mother and his uncle too. What does it all mean? Are we all powerless to escape our upbringing? As we get older, do we all transform into stereotypes of our parents and the other adults who raised us? Or, is it just those of us who have failed to grow up that get caught in this trap?

I'm not at all sure as to the meaning of Tony behaving like his Mother and/or Uncle Junior or Tony marrying someone like his mother, but I have a feeling this all relates to that and that we may be getting closer to some kind of breakthrough in our understanding of the series. It seems like a major point to understanding this entire saga is about something that Hair on Melfi's Twat said,

"Just more explanation of how disfunctional families pass on the behavioral cues that keep future families disfunctional. If AJ lives, this is just how he will speak to his kids, and his kids will do the same, and so forth. Unless, of course, someone in the family decides to break the crazy chain... Meadow, if she lives, has the potential to have a moderately health family if she stays away from her own family, if they live. Isn't this sick... "if they live?" What a life, huh?"

Oops. I am editing this post but it appears previous to HOMT's post two posts below. But I want to refer to his post here. Sorry. That must be confusing. But I don't want to try and take any credit for posting this point. It wasn't my brainstorming that resulted in this idea. It was both Clementine and Hair on Melfi's Twat and maybe some others too. It was very clever thinking and seems like it is a major concept in understanding this saga about The Sopranos. One of the major planks in this platform is the notion of how this dysfunctional behavior is passed along from generation to generation. That is mostly the idea that I have to acknowledge belongs to Hair on Melfi's Twat. But it is a great concept! It seems to be one of the major concepts in this entire saga.

Re: Favorite Quotes from 'The Second Coming'

#34
Splishak wrote:It's interesting that lately Tony is saying the same things that both Livia and Junior have said in the past. If not the exact same words, then the same intonation. It's as if I was listening to Junior say that line.


Just more explanation of how disfunctional families pass on the behavioral cues that keep future families disfunctional. If AJ lives, this is just how he will speak to his kids, and his kids will do the same, and so forth. Unless, of course, someone in the family decides to break the crazy chain... Meadow, if she lives, has the potential to have a moderately health family if she stays away from her own family, if they live. Isn't this sick... "if they live?" What a life, huh?
Christofuh says: "Tony has big decisions to make, like whether or not to have that third sandwich..." :icon_razz:

Re: Favorite Quotes from 'The Second Coming'

#35
Holy Sheet!

HoMT, You are so right! It reminds me of my paternal grandparents. They would start every other sentence by saying, "God Forbid ...". I guess it was kind of like Paulie. They kept talking about shit that was extremely negative and threatening and they figured they had to "counter" their bullshit somehow and the way to do it was to begin every thought they had by saying, "God Forbid ..."

By the way, speaking of Paulie, did you notice in this last episode, when Tony was talking with all his boys, he started off the conversation by saying something like, "OK. Let's dispense of the 800 pound gorilla in the room." Then all the guys took a turn saying something about their kids. I think they all had the same objective in mind - to make Tony feel better - except for Paulie and then later Stupid Carmine. Anyway, after all the boys say something about their kids designed to make Tony feel better about AJ, it's Paulie's turn. And what does this asshole say? It was something like this ...

"If you ask me, it's all these contaminants they put in the food today. I'm surprised that more kids ain't jumpin' off bridges." Did you catch the sideways look that Tony gave him after that? It was as if he was wishing that he had killed the asshole when he had the opportunity down in Florida when he was thinking about it on the boat.

Anyway, later on, Stupid Carmine comes to visit and what comes out of his stupid mouth? He starts off well by saying words to the effect, "Anything I can do for AJ, please let me know. When my daughter was afflicted with the bulimia, we got her a top-notch therapist." Tony asked, "She tried to kill herself?" Carmine answered, "No. She's just fine now. No problem whatsoever." I'm sorry that I don't remember this exchange very well and I can't get to my DVD for a while now. But the point is that after beginning with what sounds like some real compassion, this idiot heaps a bunch of denial on Tony by essentially claiming that his daughter never really had a serious problem and that there was really nothing wrong with her compared to AJ. It was exactly the worst thing he could have said to Tony about AJ. It was as if he offered this therapist to Tony but said that his daughter didn't really need the therapist because there was nothing wrong with her. So, what good would this therapist do AJ, then? What a jerkoff! I think Tony would have been within his rights to have killed this imbecile right then and there.

It was just a fucking idiotic thing to say to Tony and that's why I think he should be called Stupid Carmine instead of Little Carmine - for that reason and all the other times (hundreds of times) that he has said such stupid and unfeeling things to people. Not because he is unfeeling - but just because he is so stupid that he doesn't know how to speak English.

Oh, jeez. I'm really sorry. This thread is called "Favorite Quotes" and I'm writing a big long novel here. I just got carried away because I thought it was important to respond to Hair on Melfi's Twat about how Tony is passing down his parents' and uncle's way of sabotaging his kids. It seems to me that is one of the most important topics there is about this whole show. But I wish I could figure out a way to respond without writing a huge long post in this thread. If any of the moderators can think of a better thread to move this, please help me and move it so it doesn't destroy the feeling of a "Favorite Quotes" thread. Please and thank you.

P.S. If anyone wants to send me a private message about where this really belongs, let me know and I'll delete it from here and post it somewhere else. Thank you.

Re: Favorite Quotes from 'The Second Coming'

#37
Good point. How is it that she seems to have escaped both the geneology (sp?) and the family's OC interests?

And what does she represent to the overall story? Is it the notion that the "drag" placed on people like Tony and Janice need not pull them down? Witness Barbara who is not pulled down by the lure of easy money from OC or the insanity of her parents and aunts and uncles. But is it something simpler? Perhaps the intent is to suggest that some people are naturally drawn towards this way of life (criminal and violent way of life) while others are not. And some people just naturally escape with no problems at all?

Does it all really boil down to that classic age-old debate of "heredity v. environment" or "nature v. nurture"? We've touched on parts of this many times before. But this classic issue is something like the age old chicken and egg debate. There is no real solution and people can go on arguing about it forever. Jeez Louise! I hope to Hell that we won't come to the end of this show and conclude that the whole thing is just about whether heredity has more power than environment or vice versa. I recall the wonderful comedy "Trading Places" with Eddie Murphy and Dan Aykroyd and that is how they summarized the debate in that film ("heredity v environment"). But I've also seen it described as "nature v. nurture" in other places. I have a feeling that it was described some other way in the famous film, "Inherit the Wind".

Surely there is more to this show than some issue that can be encapsulated in a simple little catch phrase? I surely do hope so.

Re: Favorite Quotes from 'The Second Coming'

#38
Hey Splish, this is as good as any place to talk about that. I picked right up on your observations of the "800 pound" gorilla scene. What that showed is how disfunctional, on a personal level, all of Tony's associates are. They were each trying to make him feel better by explaining away his feelings through ineffective examples of the sufferings of others. Technically, if they really wanted to help Tony, they should have kept their mouths shut and just listened. Saying things like "you must be very upset" or "you must have been terrified for AJ" are empathetic responses, but one, that's hard for grizzled old guys to say, and two, they are all crazy disfunctional and would have never thought to say such things.... God Forbid!

Only kidding. I was brought up in a strong Irish Catholic family where shame was the tool to keep us inline. We used to hear: "you should be ashamed of yourself," or "don't do something to bring shame on yourself." AAARRRGGGHHHHH
Christofuh says: "Tony has big decisions to make, like whether or not to have that third sandwich..." :icon_razz:

Re: Favorite Quotes from 'The Second Coming'

#39
Well, I think the network should be ashamed of itself for making us wait 2 weeks for no good reason to see the last two episodes. I wonder that their thinking is. Sweeps week was over last week so it's not as if they are going to get any better ratings when they broadcast the last two episodes.

This is a very common ploy. But I have no idea why they do it. Why make us wait two weeks for the last two episodes?
Post Reply

Return to “Episode 6.19: The Second Coming”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron